Vintage Gretsch Guitars

What do you guys know about tuners?

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58 Club

62 Club

67 Gent

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Walter Broes wrote:

Yep, the open back ones you see most on vintage Gretsches are Waverly tuners :

I want a set of these circa 1960...anyone?

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My 59 Annie has the Grover Statite butterbeans.

Scottie

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Tuners on my partly original Synchromatic 200, looks original but i don't know.

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The only thing I "know" about tuners (tuning machines) is that I don't trust open back units and have always replaced open backs with Schaller 12:1 at least on my guitars.

I prefer sealed tuners. Even have them on my 1935 Dobro.

Not "original"? Who cares?

I intend to play the damn thing and I don't want a funky tuner letting me down at the wrong time.

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This post has been deleted

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Now, anyone care to tell us where replacement tuners may be found? I'm interested in a set or, or single open-back gold Waverly for my '54 or so Electro II, 6193. Stripped gear on treble side tuner (g, as it happens). Stewart-McDonald has Waverlies, but not this style, also seem to have different string post diameter, and mounting. I measure the shaft of the tuner as 3/16" and the mounting screws with 15/16 centers.

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I had to replace the tuners on my 67 Viking. The new tuners are much bigger than the original Imperials and my luthier gently made each hole larger. Grover said they moved to metric sizes in 1980.

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Beanfan wrote: Now, anyone care to tell us where replacement tuners may be found? I'm interested in a set or, or single open-back gold Waverly for my '54 or so Electro II, 6193.

They don't exist. That's why nobody has mentioned them.

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My '67 Single Anniversary has tuners like the second photo daverave posted; only not gold. The buttons seem metal but it's a '67 and I can't tell. Are those Waverly's? Also; my '66 Hagstrom Viking has Van Ghent tuners; but they don't look like the one's pictured on the Gent. They have the same tapered outline; but a chunkier rectangular base.

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My TU-2 drove me nuts! Found contentment with my Peterson Turbo stomp.

My only Gretsch right now the 6073 Electrotone bass is listed to come with locking Sperzels. Wrong! Normal bass Sperzels are the standard

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My '67 Single Anniversary has tuners like the second photo daverave posted; only not gold. The buttons seem metal but it's a '67 and I can't tell. Are those Waverly's?

Dave's second picture shows Van Ghents. Those were always metal. It's the oval button Waverly tuners that switched to chromed plastic buttons.

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What I know......... Me turn knob string go tight...... Me turn knob string go loose. 8-o

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I use the Tuneup tuner app on my I phone in quiet environments because it has a variety of displays including strobe and is very accurate. However, not good for stage use.

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My 1957 6120's "Butterbean Grover" tuners -

-- 57 Chet

Does anyone know if the current Grover Sta Tite V97 model retro fit the 57-58 Gretsches in terms of:

1) existing screw holes match up (the holes should be exactly 1'' apart)

2) fit through original ferrules

3) matching the footprint of the original on the surface of the back of the headstock, and

4) the diameter and length of the post?

The new model's buttons clearly do not look the same and the new ones also come in 18/1, both of which are fine; I just don't do want to put new holes or make a new surface impression into the back of the headstock if possible.

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My 1957 6120's "Butterbean Grover" tuners -

-- 57 Chet

Does anyone know if the current Grover Sta Tite V97 model retro fit the 57-58 Gretsches in terms of:

1) existing screw holes match up (the holes should be exactly 1'' apart)

2) fit through original ferrules

3) matching the footprint of the original on the surface of the back of the headstock, and

4) the diameter and length of the post?

The new model's buttons clearly do not look the same and the new ones also come in 18/1, both of which are fine; I just don't do want to put new holes or make a new surface impression into the back of the headstock if possible.

-- knavel

I had a set of the new Grover 18:1 "butterbean" tuners installed in place of the stock Sta-tites and they were close but not a perfect match; had to drill new screw holes, but I can't remember if the tech drilled one or two new holes for each tuner. I actually prefer the Guitarfetish ones that look the same. http://www.guitarfetish.com/Vintage-Waverly-style-tuners-GOLD-complete-set_p_848.html Here is the text of a post I made on the other site in response to the Guitarfetish Waverly copies:

I have installed two sets of these in chrome, but on 61XX series guitars. The ones I bought specified an 18:1 ratio. On the Guitarfetish site they don't specify this for the gold ones. If anyone has this info please post as I need a set of the gold ones. So, assuming these are the same as the chrome 18:1 tuners I can say that they are much better than the stock Grover Sta-tites that Gretsch uses in most of their guitars. I also had a guitar with the Grover tuners that look identical to these and I liked these better. The Grovers had a lot of play whereas these Waverly style from Guitarfetish have little to none. I have them in my 6119FT and will be replacing all of my Sta-tite tuners with these. For the price they can't be beat in my opinion. As far as fit, they are not a drop in unless you want to angle the screws quite a bit. The posts fit perfectly into the Sta-tite bushings, so no routing is necessary. To install here is what I did: [1] Remove old tuners and fill screw holes with segments of round wooden toothpicks. Use some wood glue but avoid epoxy, crazy glue etc. in case someone wants to reinstall the originals and re-drill the screw holes. [2] After the glue has dried, using the new tuners as a guide, mark the spots for the new screw holes. I like to position the new tuners at an angle that looks "right" to my eye; balanced. I tape them all in place to see how it looks then mark the spots for the new screw holes. Use an electric drill with a bit that is the same diameter as the screw shaft (the part of the screw inside the actual threads) or slightly smaller. Don't go too small as too much pressure from the new screws has the potential of splitting the headstock. Before drilling, mark the depth on the drill bit with a piece of masking tape. (This prevents drilling too deeply.) [3] Install the new tuners and run her up the flagpole.

I like these tuners also because they look a little retro. I know that doesn't make much sense since the guitars are modern, but part of the Gretsch allure is the nod to tradition in their designs. -Roy

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Followup to last post: I see that there are three diffirent Waverly style butterbean tuners advertised on the Guitarfetish site. I have e mailed them for information on the differences, if any, in shaft, ratio and screw hole spacing. I'll post again when I have that info. -Roy

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There is another tuner not previously mentioned:

Gold Kluson Sealfast "double ring" tuner - This heavy high-end sealed tuner is often seen - oddly enough - on the stripped-down wartime 16-inch Synchromatic, with translucent white ("Catalin"?) button.

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Followup to last post: I see that there are three diffirent Waverly style butterbean tuners advertised on the Guitarfetish site. I have e mailed them for information on the differences, if any, in shaft, ratio and screw hole spacing. I'll post again when I have that info. -Roy

-- journeyman

OK, here is what I received from Guitarfetish:

"The E33 http://www.guitarfetish.com/181-Wilkinson-Open-Back-3x3-Waverly-Style-Vintage-Tune... are not available in gold. The other two sets http://www.guitarfetish.com/Vintage-Waverly-style-tuners-GOLD-complete-set_p_848.html and http://www.guitarfetish.com/Vintage-Waverly-style-tuners-complete-set-chrome_p_847... have the same spacing and dimensions but I believe they are a 14:1 ratio."

I have only used the E33 set and find them better than the Grover butterbeans but I haven't used the other two sets so can't give an opinion. I need a set of gold ones so will continue my search as I don't like the 14:1 ratio. 18:1 is much smoother. -Roy

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It looks like in the pictures of the new V97 that the footprint (design) of the 18:1 is different than the 14:1. Elderly is the only place where I've found any measurements and from these it seems like the 14:1 would be a perfect fit in my 58 Duo Jet.

The fit is only one part of the issue--the original Grovers which are just worn out have made an impression in the finish and I want to match this with the new tuners, hence my question. Otherwise I could stick a set of Waverlys in there as I have a few of them from that time period.

When you talk about the 18:1 requiring new holes well that's certainly something I don't want at all. I think I'll just take a punt on the 14:1 V97s and see how it goes. If they don't fit then I'll flip them on ebay and lose $10-15. Whatever.

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i would say, you are still in the ballpark in a realistic market, and not a fishing market.

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My '67 Gretsch Monkee's Rock 'n Roll Guitar... is now as close to stock as I can get it... the tuner for the G string was the last thing I needed to get and it was delivered today... its had the wrong tuner for close to 39 years... that tuner was the last piece of the puzzle..HOOOORAAAAY... I started looking for the tuner a year and a half ago and finally found it !!! Thanks Steve the Guitar Guy (The Benevolent Mr. Senerchia) for the tuner and and Paul Setzer for the pick guard and truss rod cover. Those were hard to find.


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