Pickups

Installing a T-Armond neck pickup upside down, you do that?

1

I know you do Tavo. I might try it with mine. What are the benefits of it? I think you've mentioned it makes it less boomy sounding?

Anyone else do this too?

2

Tvjones advised this and it works GREAT! This guitar isnt meant for sitting quietly in a room with a tiny amp and playing Chet tunes. Its on stage plugged into a 45watt blondeshell and fender tonemaster closeback 212 w V30s fed by an 11 pedal frenzy. I dont need my bass any bigger than it is, and I have the level on the amp bass control at 2. So by flipping it over, I got a slightly leaner bass that lets the notes remain defined with overdrive (I dont use anything heavy at all) delay and reverb. Also the highs are smoother, as dynas can be freaking evil through fender amps. I actually still have very good hearing at 50 and I plan to keep it. :) Flip side literally is needed for my sugarpine tele, it needs more definition in the highs and switching between tele and gretsch means I want more low end from the plank guitar and to get the best of the "knocky pluck" from the bridge position with stainless steel bridge and saddles flipping it was just the trick. It has a 500K vol pot and 250K tone pot.

4

Do you really think a human can hear the difference.. Sorry Tavo.. I'm calling Bullshit on that

5

It makes a difference when you rotate an Sg's bridge humbucker round 180 degress. So why not when you flip a T-armond upside down?

6

Do you really think a human can hear the difference.. Sorry Tavo.. I'm calling Bullshit on that

– Billy D Light

you can call bullshit on that Billy D, but if you stand in front of me with the Falcon and blonde bassman and I turn around the neck pickup, when it PHYSICALLY moves the slugs further from the fretboard (and the same holds for the bridge pickups slugs) and you cant hear the change..

it may be seriously be time for this my elder brother..

8

ha!!!!!!!!!!!

– Billy D Light

ha.. ?? c'mon.. You do realize the slugs are not centered in the pickup like a P90, flipping them around actually moves the slugs forward or backwards.

9

ha.. ?? c'mon.. You do realize the slugs are not centered in the pickup like a P90, flipping them around actually moves the slugs forward or backwards.

– THE NOCTURNE BRAIN™

Ahhh C'mon.. really? The 1/4 change in slug position up by the neck is gonna make a difference you can hear that much. I wouldn't argue the bridge position making an audible difference but the neck P'up.

IMHO it would be negligible at best. Probably beyond the scope of human hearing, certainly not the least bit noticable outside of your bedroom

10

I've no idea whether or not I could tell any difference if a neck position T-Armond pickup is flipped in this way. There are sounds I like and sounds I don't like, and I've always tried to put out a sound that I like. But I've long ago given up being obsessively anal about it, given the number of components and variables between the strings on a guitar and the amplifier's speaker cone — to say nothing of the audio chain being used by a sound crew let loose with a mixing desk and a bunch of outboard gear.

Also, I would have thought that variations in venue acoustics usually more than counter any slight tonal change made by flipping a pickup. My brother-in-law's band is currently on a UK theatre tour and we've been to see them twice in the last week — once in a beautiful concert hall in central London (Cadogan Hall) and then in our local theatre. Each venue holds around 1000 people. Out in the auditorium, the lead guitar player's sound was totally different over the two nights — same guitars (a handmade Rick Turner Lindsey Buckingham model, and a Les Paul), same Vox AC30 amp and the same PA system and sound crew. Flipping a pickup? Purely on sound, he could have been playing a completely different rig.

However, I will say that my current main gigging guitar is a Strat with a bridge humbucker (both coils are identical) which can be coil tapped by a three-way switch. The three-way switch can take out either coil, effectively 'moving' my bridge single coil by about half an inch or so. I've no idea if anyone in the audience can notice any difference through the general band racket (or even cares), but listening at home there is definitely a difference (albeit a slight one) between the two single coils of the same pickup. I've long ago given up worrying about it.

11

Tavo,

Why don't you reverse the bridge as well? I've always felt a little more "beef" out of the bridge is a good thing.....

When I get the T-Series T'As for my Hot Rod, I'm installing both of them "slugs in"

12

Billy, You and I must be brothers separated at birth. I can see doing everything you can at the point of entry in the chain, i.e. the Guitar then pedals then amp but I have to agree with what Dave_K and Billy said.

Will it really make that big of a difference when you depend on a room and a sound guy?

13

Where you pluck the strings has a bigger effect than a little shift in pole placement.

Still, I support any twisting, turning, flipping and shifting that gives you the sound you want.

14

Where you pluck the strings has a bigger effect than a little shift in pole placement.

Still, I support any twisting, turning, flipping and shifting that gives you the sound you want.

– NJBob

Totally true, but now you're talking a whole 'nuther ball of wax.... "learning technique".... this here discussion is about GEAR, got it?!?! MAGIC gear that has inherent tone and makes us sound glorious!!!! You want to talk about technique, head over to the jazz forums

15

"You want to talk about technique, head over to the jazz forums"

Ha!

16

Like Dave_K, I long ago gave up caring about the obsessively anal.

Great thread.

17

There's plenty of technique discussed here. The same folks who claim rarefied knowledge of the magic gear will resort to 'tone is in the hands' when BS is called on the gear.

18

I'm thinking you could hear a difference. I've thought about switching my neck Dynasonic around on my Duo Jet but I noticed that the slugs are right beneath where the imaginary 24th fret harmonic is. I'm thinking it was an intentional design to place the slugs directly under there. I think so because I intentionally placed the neck pickup poles directly under that harmonic on my original designed guitar.

19

There's plenty of technique discussed here. The same folks who claim rarefied knowledge of the magic gear will resort to 'tone is in the hands' when BS is called on the gear.

– tommy59

uh... it was a joke Tommy. Hence the

20

I'm shrugging my shoulders here, as this really isnt some hair splitting thing like tone cap "ceramic versus oil n foil.. not at all. Rather its simply a very simple solution for a relational problem with the jazz box and the single coil.. In the big body guitars, flipping the pickup so that the slugs are moved slightly away from the fretboard alleviates boominess on the lower strings.

A for example would be one of my favorite players Junior Barnard's guitar. He had a DeArmond FHC "monkey on a stick" as his rhythm pickup on that big epiphone jazz box.

If you put an FHC single coil too close to the neck the boominess is so bad your amp wants to blow up..but simply moving the pickup back away from the fretboard and voila, balanced output. I use this example because I'm doing the poor mans jr Barnard setup with my 48' Silvertone and I cant find a dang monkey stick for my FHC and Ive got it mounted up under the fretboard w velcro until I can buy the stick mount, its almost unusable from the massive bass except for very low volume so I rely on my undersaddle pickup on stage w the bassman and lr baggs pre.

So in the case of the Falcon, it was a no brainer to turn it around and attenuate the boomy low for a wonderful classic Dynasonic response from these unique DeArmond "T-armond" filtertron mounts.. which by the way sit right on top of the tone rails and yes you can raise and lower the slugs a tiny bit but there isnt too much room to drop the low E side of the pickups magnets. Cant lower the body of the pickup, its sitting on fiberboard mounting plates so the pickup and the mounting plate rests directly on the guitars tonerails that its screwed down into.. again, the solution, flip the freakin pickup. no magic dust involved.

21

I think the skepticism is because of the very small distance the pickup slugs get moved on a Dynasonic pickup when you flip it.

22

I think the skepticism is because of the very small distance the pickup slugs get moved on a Dynasonic pickup when you flip it.

– BuddyHollywood

That's interesting, considering so many people here accept the difference in raising or lowering a pickup 1/16".... I'm with Tavo, this ain't rocket science. And I'm sure different guitars and pickups will react a bit differently, and the results may be subtle... but with all the other gear topics around here that come down to "that last 5%", I find it funny so many people dismissing this "pickup flip" out of hand.

And, before someone chimes in, allow me.... "OOOHHHHHH, but VERTICAL movement is a WHOLE DIFFERENT THING"...... lol Yes, it is different. But both techniques move the poles, and moving the poles in either direction DOES make a tonal difference... how much depends on how sensitive your hearing is I guess.....

23

That's interesting, considering so many people here accept the difference in raising or lowering a pickup 1/16".... I'm with Tavo, this ain't rocket science. And I'm sure different guitars and pickups will react a bit differently, and the results may be subtle... but with all the other gear topics around here that come down to "that last 5%", I find it funny so many people dismissing this "pickup flip" out of hand.

And, before someone chimes in, allow me.... "OOOHHHHHH, but VERTICAL movement is a WHOLE DIFFERENT THING"...... lol Yes, it is different. But both techniques move the poles, and moving the poles in either direction DOES make a tonal difference... how much depends on how sensitive your hearing is I guess.....

– ruger9

Yeah I don't go for that either......

24

Yeah I don't go for that either......

– Billy D Light

At least you're consistent! Props!

25

O.K. That does make more sense. I have had success raising pickups so I'll just shut up now.


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