The Gretsch Pages: Discussions: Other Amps: Speaker ideas

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Speaker ideas

- Rated: 83 ↑
Sep 7, 2008 10:24 p.m. Mark Synchro:

All of this talk about senojnad's new Exec has the squeaky wheels turning in my head. I am hoping to convert my Twin into a separate head and cabinet soon, basically a Showman look-a-like in white tolex. My initial idea was to get a closed-back cabinet with two 12" speakers that would be capable of standing up to the low notes of my E-E baritone.

Anyhow, all of senojnad's talk about the wonder of hos Exec has me thinking, would it be a better idea to put a single 15" speaker in this amp? In any event, I'm planning to use neodymium magnet speakers to keep the schlep factor as low as possible. A single 15 would have 176 sq in of speaker area vs. 226 sq in of speaker area for a pair of 12s.

One last point. The twangy, clean sound of the Twin is exactly what I like. I'm not looking for piercing highs or earthquake lows, just a good balanced sound like the stock Twin has, but in an easier to carry package.

OK, fire at will.
- Rated: 40 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 12:06 a.m. roadjunkie:

Mark you need one if these I tell ya!
- Rated: 83 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 1:05 a.m. Mark Synchro:

It probably wouldn't work for my needs. This is basically going to be used as a bass amp with the possibility of some duty as a guitar amp as well. For this reason I have to have a closed-back cabinet and deep basket speakers in order to handle the low end.

As far as small and portable is concerned, I already have a Blues Jr that I've modded to the point of sounding like a boutique amp. It has a modified tone stack, the bias is set lower (which makes the amp hiss less and eat tubes more slowly), a presence control (which takes it from Tweedsville to Surf City at the twist of a knob) and an upgraded output transformer. All in all, it sounds a lot better than it should for as little as I have in it. Tomorrow, BTW, it's getting an upgraded reverb unit as well.

I actually still have a couple of simple mods in mind but even as it is this moment it's a great amp. One simple piece of wire across one pot and I have a blackface tone stack. Stick a switch into that circuit and now I have it all.

If I'm playing a Gretsch with Filters I tend to turn the presence control up beyond the (detented) mid-point and it acheives a clear sound. OTOH, if I want to play one of my Fenders through it, or possibly my Dynasonic Jet, I'd turn the presence below the mid-point and the sound stays clean, but loses some of its clarity. I also play it through a single 12" bass cab a lot of the time which allows me to use it as a practice amp for my bass without fear of damaging the speaker and the sound quality is great for either bass or guitar.

I know that it's fashionable to dislike these little amps but I couldn't be happier with mine. Even with all of the mods I still have less than 2/3 the price of a DRRI invested and it's served me well on many a gig. If it wasn't for the fact that I play some bass and some E-E baritone I probably wouldn't even have a big amp.
- Rated: 66 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 11:42 a.m. Walter Broes:

Mark, if you use your baritone for typical twangy reverb and trem-heavy Duane Eddy meets Ennio Morricone stuff, you're going to lose some of that airy spaciousness with a closed back cabinet, but you probably know that. And a closed back cabinet with heavy duty speakers might actually get some earthquake lows you're saying you're not looking for.

RJ, I love a D130 too, but wouldn't be plugging a twin into a single one with an open back cab be a little risky?
- Rated: 40 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 9:49 p.m. roadjunkie:

You know what Walter that's a good question! I'm looking into at the most a 30 to 60 watt head to mate up with this. Still I didn't know how much it could handle so I did some research and came up with a web page by the guy who tested these at the factory. I wish I would have saved the page but according to him it would have handled an 85 watt load yet I didn't feel it was a clear enough answer. I didn't come away with a definite answer on how much wattage it could handle. Nonetheless I don't think I need anything that big. The 2 leading contenders are 40 and 50 watts respectively. Of course there's nothing written on the speaker that helps.
- Rated: 41 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 9:59 p.m. J(esse James)D:

Look into a WeberVST speaker.

They make the "California" series, which I believe is their version of the JBL.

They also offer "high power" versions of their speakers.

Worth a look and thought: www.webervst.com

They also offer the NeoMags. Some good reading material if nothing else
- Rated: 83 ↑
Sep 8, 2008 10:36 p.m. Mark Synchro:

I guess that what I'm doing is trying to cover as many bases as possible with one amp. I play guitar, baritone and bass, sometimes all in the same night. I don't play large venues so even as a bass amp 85 watts should be more than plenty and I'm not popping and slapping when I play.

The baritone is indeed used for the "Duane Eddy meets Ennio Morricone" sound. One of my favorite things about old Bass VI recordings from the '60s is the sound of spring reverb trying to maintain its composure on ultra low notes. There's almost a click at the very millesecond the note is played.
- Rated: 21 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 6:59 a.m. GentlBen:

I have a Blackface Bassman mounted in a tweed combo cab and I had considered modifying it with a hinged panel so that I could close or open the back and use it for either bass or lead.

Has anyone out there tried anything like this?
- Rated: 66 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 8:01 a.m. Walter Broes:

RJ, I think you're referring to Harvey Gerst, I have some of that saved in a word file, found this buried in my pc :

I saw a lot of D130's come through with fried voice coils that were running off a 12 Watt Williamson amp during the 50's and 60's. Integrated music from HiFi systems caused one kind of problem - using the D130 as a musical instrument speaker created other problems.

That's why I suggested the D130F (which was a redesigned D130), made expressly for musical instrument amps, as were the D110F (a totally new design), the D120F (a redesign of the D131), and the D140F (a new design using existing parts).

Power specifications for the F series were nominally 35 to about 60 Watts. How did I arrive at these figures? Pretty simple, I played guitar and bass through them and kept increasing the power till they blew. Then I downrated them from the power that fried them. Pretty hi-tech, huh? It seemed to work pretty well (of course we didn't have synth players back then).

The major amp manufacturers back then were Fender, Sunn, Kustom, and Ampeg. Rickenbacher and Mosrite also bought some, but nowhere near the volume of the other amp makers. All had JBL speaker options.

And yes, the "F" stood for Fender, since they were the largest single buyer, and also distributed the F series to music stores. They had no part in the design or the idea for the new series, I am solely to blame for that.

Harvey Gerst

I have noticed with the 10" versions I have, putting them in a closed back cab makes a big difference in how much power they'll take before they "protest".
- Rated: 21 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 9:58 a.m. GentlBen:

Walter Broes said: I have noticed with the 10" versions I have, putting them in a closed back cab makes a big difference in how much power they'll take before they "protest".

I noticed the same thing with my milkcan EV SRO. It is a great clean lead speaker in an open back cab but a bass will make it rattle. Putting it in a closed unported box makes it an excellent bass speaker.
- Rated: 66 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 10:02 a.m. Walter Broes:

It's not a big mystery - there's less "cone excursion" in a closed back cab, so the speaker breaks up less. That's what I've been told anyway...
- Rated: 16 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 10:32 a.m. Gigatron:

I've never had an amp that was good for both guitar and bass. The closest were the old Fender Bassman and Traynor Bassmaster heads my friends and I used to use back in the 60s and 70s, but we would still use different speaker cabinets: 4 x 12" open back cabinets for guitar, 2 x 15" or 8 x 10" closed back for bass. Neither very compact.
- Rated: 21 ↑
Sep 9, 2008 11:23 a.m. GentlBen:

I think closing the back on a single 12 will give me all the bass I need for playing at home and I can open the back and have a sweet lead amp for gigging. I believe I can give it a try without drilling any holes and see how it sounds sealed up.

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