On the 'tube

How is this NOT copyright infringement?

1

Don't get me wrong. I'm not a fan of this girl ad could barely give a crap but how is this not copyright infringement?

She's certainly a pretty gal and has a wonderful voice so I don't want to come off as a hater BUT....c'mon....reallly?

I had read that she had three number one songs all at once and thought, hey, what am I missing so I gave them a listen. Wow. Kids will buy anything these days.

2

nope. not gonna listen to Ariana Grande. Lana Del Rey is bad enough.

3

At first glance, maybe it’s old enough to where it may be public domain...BUT...don’t even think of holding me to that. Not to mention licensing, which the label may have paid, for all we know...and then there’s Harry Fox...

4

...because it’s not. Believe me, all is well in copyright land. Ariana Grande has been in the music business for a long time, there is no way that this was a casual “sample” of the classic My Favorite Things by Rogers and Hammerstein.

Rogers and Hammerstein top the Pop charts

5

Popular music has moved away from the days of young people forming a band, writing their own material, recording it and having it released. The emphasis now is on slick production of a product that is danceable and where the artist looks good. I long for a return to artists who actually learn to play an instrument and then perform their own music without resorting to recording tricks to make it listenable.

Now, this is entirely incongruous on my part because there are certainly popular artists from the 1950s and 1960s who did not play an instrument or write their own songs whose artistry I really did enjoy. Petula Clark immediately comes to mind, as does Tom Jones. So, I am unable to reconcile that in my own mind without spending more time on it than I presently have. Suffice it to say that I wish that we had more "bands" topping the charts rather than young men and women who dress to tantalize. Give me Janis or even Joss Stone rather than Ariana Grande.

Now, get the hell offa my lawn.

6

given the expense associated with keeping a permanent band (and keeping the band happy!) i don't think that pop will see a band resurgence. it just doesn't make sense for that business model when you can just send homegirl out there with a DJ and/or a backing tape. on the other hand, bands still dominate more-or-less independent music, which bands seem to occupy ~70% of the total with the rest made up of solo artists, many of them women.

7

I don't care who they are or what they sing. I just wish rhythm sections were live musicians and not looped and sequenced samples and bits - that I could feel the structured and pitched sonic phenomena breathe.

Then it might feel like music again.

Even the strictest possible adherence by humans to a click yields recognizably musical results, even if complete trainwrecks are repaired in a computer.

I hear pitches in this construction, and harmonies, and I recognize that the singer hits the right notes. God knows there's something reminiscent of rhythm. (I wanted to say the rhythms of a factory, but I've worked in factories. There's far more rhythmic interest in the unintended interplay of repetitive motions of various machines, each at their own tempo - AND their tempos varying over time, sometimes actually in response to human mangement. I would literally rather listen to recordings from a factory floor than this.)

The arrangement and the sounds are OK. (Let's not mention the inane lyrics and the lifestyle they celebrate.) The percussion tinks and dinks are toylike and silly, their lockstep and looped repetition mind-numbing (if it weren't too infuriating to listen to long enough to get numb.) The quantized ratcheting of the auto-tuned vocal robotically shovels the dirt onto this casket of organized sound.

Which might correspond to my notion of music if they'd just let the damn corpse breathe.

(And I say all this as someone who likes playing music along with machines.)

In this piece-o-pop-pablum, I hear the vocally gifted (really - it's a great voice) and genetically endowed but hapless human female (displayed for the market as though the body is some stunning innovation) cooing and crooning through her routine on top of this recording.

I just don't hear humanity in the lifeless moving mass beneath it. It's truly like someone turned on the machine and left the premises.

8

well, i'm a big fan of EDM/IDM (electronic/"intelligent" dance music) so i don't mind synthetic so much, but the really good EDM artists put some wiggle room into the arrangements so every single thing isn't absolutely slaved to the main pulse. there can be great enjoyment in using the electronic beat as a carrier wave. but the kind of rinky-tink stuff that modern pop artists use leaves me absolutely cold. Public Enemy, si; K-Pop, no.

9

Don't get me wrong. I'm not a fan of this girl ad could barely give a crap but how is this not copyright infringement?

She's certainly a pretty gal and has a wonderful voice so I don't want to come off as a hater BUT....c'mon....reallly?

I had read that she had three number one songs all at once and thought, hey, what am I missing so I gave them a listen. Wow. Kids will buy anything these days.

– Suprdave

well... I learned Classical music from Cartoons. Generation Z can now learn through Pop Hotties great American standards. There IS hope america :)

10

...because it’s not. Believe me, all is well in copyright land. Ariana Grande has been in the music business for a long time, there is no way that this was a casual “sample” of the classic My Favorite Things by Rogers and Hammerstein.

Rogers and Hammerstein top the Pop charts

– Deed Eddy

Thanks for that, Miss. Deed.

All is good.

11

i'm a big fan of EDM/IDM (electronic/"intelligent" dance music) so i don't mind synthetic so much,

I love synths, and there's EDM/IDM I can listen to. And not only because there's more humanity in the rhythm, but because there's WAY more creativity happening on top of it in the form of novel sounds and evolving textures.

I get the distinction, and I'd agree with that.

And, as I said, I positively enjoy playing along with the "machines" on my pedalboard. For one thing, my rhythm isn't good enough to comply with the lockstep of their repeating delays and other contributions. For another, I can react to them - play along with the sometimes surprising evolution of their contributions (for which I set the parameters) - without letting them run the show. (And, when the device allows, I like to dial a certain degree of randomness into their activities.)

That way, I'm the humanity in the operation - and, with some randomness in the operation of several pedals engaged at the same time, I feel like the machines and I are at least meeting each other halfway.

12

Interesting reading Deed.

For what it's worth, I think it's a right nifty little pop song.

13

Anyone can record any copyrighted material they want. They just have to pay a mechanical lisencing fee, based on the number of units manufactured. I don't know how digital mechanicals are calculated. Radio airplay royalties, etc. (not the same as mechanicals) would be split with whoever owns the material. In this case, the original words are not being used, so that removes 50%, and only a portion of the melody is being used, so that would be a percentage of the remaining 50%.

Is this example music? Is Wonderbread, bread? It's got some wheat in it. Is it about music? Absolutely not. It's about marketing, and nothing more.

14

From the linked Forbes article:

Grande had transformed the meaning of the innocent tune. Instead of being a sweet song about the simple things in life, the popular singer had turned it into an ode to materialism. She replaced an appreciation of "raindrops on roses and whiskers on kittens" with demands for "breakfast at Tiffany's and bottles of bubbles."

"Ariana takes the same boast of money and possessions that male rap and hip-hop artists use and turns it into an all female declaration of material success," observed actor Nicholas Hammond, who performed in the 1965 film adaptation of The Sound of Music. "The contrast between the sweetness and simplicity of the original and the consumerism of her version to me is a comment on the world today," he said.

Uh-huh. I think it's a bit of stretch to interpret "female" appropriation of "male" acquisitive lust and materialistic boasting as any sort of feminism, as this specious reasoning implies. Mens and wimmens have both been plenty greedy, materialist, and boastful for...something like millennia? OK, at least a couple of centuries. And hello? "Diamonds Are a Girl's Best Friend," like from the 50s? This is hardly new territory.

It's certainly possible to see this "ode to materialism" as a "comment on the world today." But there's no evidence to me that Ariana herself is making that judgment. I don't sense any ironic commentary. Sure looks to me like she's celebrating the unbridled exercise of her wealth and license entirely un-self-consciously - contributing to a culture of consumption and excess, not decrying it.

15

the Society of the Spectacle strikes again.

16

Here's a breath of fresh air, y'all, to wipe the memory of that annoying pop-tart outcher ears. THIS is how you do it!

17

I really should apologize for making you guys listen to that.

18

that Forbes article is kinda funny....instead of all the blaablablabla cultural this, yada yada interesting that, it might as well have read.."hmmmm....this could make us a crap load of money!".....(which is OK, I didn't really need all the justification..)

19

Yes an adaptation. You cant just rely on a stat licence if you change lyrics . Clearance would have been acquired from the original rightsholders.

It’s actually chilling. There are no simple things to be appreciated in her version. A girl born giftted with looks and blessed with luck (not saying she hasn’t worked hard but you can not deny the role of luck in any life) bragging about what she has and can acquire.

So much of the flaunting of beauty and $ online. Not a kind world for those not blessed with beauty or wealth.

20

materialism has been turning me off of various types of popular music for decades now. the main reason i despised the disco movement was due to the hierarchicalism, the good-looks/expensive-clothes-required Studio 54 vibe...i actually liked Euro-disco a la Silver Convention. but i felt like we'd just spent a decade getting away from the 'I HAVE MORE STUFF" thing. more recently, the rise of look-at-my-bling turned me off to post-80s hip-hop as much or more as the "gangsta" thing. before punk became a trend-follower thing, one thing i liked very much was that people that weren't conventionally "beautiful" (Lora Logic of X-Ray Spex springs immediately to mind) could be successful.

21

In an odd way, I was reminded of Marilyn Monroe and "Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend", which as I recall had an almost overwhelming amount of pink background to it. And which was appropriated so perfectly years later for "Material Girl"..

So in the end, could this truly be thought of as just a 2019 iteration of the Monroe/Ciccone concept(s)?

22

I don't imagine it would be hard at all to go back to the 20s, and probably much earlier, and find examples from the "I like sparkly expensive things" genre in pop music.

And one could probably find examples from each period where people decried either "these kids today" or "we've all gone materialistic"

23

I don't imagine it would be hard at all to go back to the 20s, and probably much earlier, and find examples from the "I like sparkly expensive things" genre in pop music.

And one could probably find examples from each period where people decried either "these kids today" or "we've all gone materialistic"

– Baxter

Oh yeah. Betty Boop- "I Wanna Be Loved By You" (itself appropriated by Monroe in "Gentlemen Prefer Blondes"), and Mae West ("I'm No Angel") come to mind... and almost anything by Busby Berkley.

They all have very much the same message.

24

“Only sick music makes money today.” - Friedrich Nietzsche

25

Here's a breath of fresh air, y'all, to wipe the memory of that annoying pop-tart outcher ears. THIS is how you do it!

– Parabar

damn skippy!


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