Honestly, I do not care what the name on the headstock is if I like how the guitar plays and sounds.

I gigged for over a year on a Harmony Rebel just like this one that I bought in a pawnshop for chump change.

I don't care for the cheesy controls, but ya know Bear, that is a cool looking guitar!

I agree but the cheesy controls actually worked a lot better than they looked and the guitar sounded great. It is one I would love to have back.

The old adage will always ring true: YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR!!!!!!!

-sonnyjimslim

See you at the Mall with all the other believers.

I'm wonder if that slogan should read: "You always THINK you get what you pay for!"?

"REAL"? Hmmmm, look at it this way: Like silicon boobies, if you can touch them ,they are REAL!

My new little ol' Gretsch G5435t Pro Jet sounds and feels real to me, and that's what counts. I got plenty of guitar for what I paid. The Black Top FilterTrons are sweet.

Someone is bound to think their boobies are better because they're pre-Baldwin

Tone is in the cone, be it alnipco or ceramic.

A young guitar slinger who I play some gigs with showed up last week with a cheap, crappy 1960s Japanese Jaguar copy. What a piece of crap!

He proceeded to play the dog squeezin's out of this piece of junk for the half of the gig that he wasn't playing steel. He sounded great playing what I would consider to be a toy guitar.

If your point is that tone is in the fingers,you'll get an enthusiatic thumbs up from everyone here.That's not the same thing as saying an Electromatic is the same as Chet's Gent.

Or is it?

I guess my point is that I don't care all that much if you paid $50 or $5,000 for your guitar. There are plenty of guys with nice instruments who don't show me much. It seems like obsessing about the fine points of guitar construction is distracting.

Whether an instrument is the top of the line or entry level quality, if it's what you need to get the job done, feel free to use what you want. It seems to me that what we choose to play often simply reflects an image we'd like to project. If you can really swing on an Electromatic, you'll project a better image than if you suck on a Country Club.

Our tools should never keep us from doing our job well. I own a number of guitars of various dollar values. The cheapest one is a Tele, of which I haven't even approached the limits of what the guitar will do. I just wonder if there is anyone here who's abilities exceed the limits of an Electromatic.

My 5120 and my 6184 (a 1956 Electromatic) are far from being the fanciest guitars I own. They are what they are, and no pretense can be made that these are "the same" as a 6120. I'd be shocked, however, if I ever got to a point where I felt the quality of the guitars was holding me back.

Seriously people, ten pages of subjective talk, grab any guitar and play something, anything.

maybe cuz we've been waiting for a luthier's synopsis on build construction and material (wood n paint) differences that would make it clear that you are getting what you pay for either direction or maybe opposite. c'mon now curt.... c-h-i-c-k-en bawk bawk!

maybe cuz we've been waiting for a luthier's synopsis on build construction and material (wood n paint) differences that would make it clear that you are getting what you pay for either direction or maybe opposite. c'mon now curt.... c-h-i-c-k-en bawk bawk!

It appears that it isn't going to happen. Either no one has sufficient information to post about it, or they are not inclined to do so. I say let it rest. We have managed to beat this one up pretty good, both this time and countless times in the past.

Dont make me drive to truckee and document your pro line guitar collection.

maybe cuz we've been waiting for a luthier's synopsis on build construction and material (wood n paint) differences that would make it clear that you are getting what you pay for either direction or maybe opposite. c'mon now curt.... c-h-i-c-k-en bawk bawk!

Haven't we had these details before (poly vs. nitro/ply tops vs carved/different bracing methods)? And doesn't it all come down to how that actually sounds to the ear? So, do we just end up with more Kool Aid?

I wonder how much higher the street price would be if the Electromatics were made the same way they are now at the Terada factory.

Those details have been spelled out but maybe I am not communicating clear enough.. there is a difference between the variety of plywoods out there and within that is the lamination density or how I understand it "void free" like the premium cabinets I have mojotone make for me. I will never use their economy cabs that use an inferior construction, which is light and affordable (1/2" birch ply with lap joints) but not to my build standards (which is solid pine cab with finger joints and birch ply baffles).

So I'd love to know what sort of wood, what ply quality (for both series) is used for:

top and and back

sides

kerfs,rails,etc.

also.. contrasts of how many coats of sealer, paint, clear

I know I havent stated what my personal opinion is but that doesnt matter because I'm trying to find out some of these things that always get overlooked in this type of discussion which often (and thank god its not happening here) gets into the poor kids giving the rich kids the middle finger and the rich kids snubbing their noses at the poor kids..

I'm hoping my intention is understood and at some point there arises one who has statistics, data, photos, video, microfiche,8-track, telegraphs, hieroglyphics...

I want to know too. I would also like to know for both series' the build time, what is built with machines and what is built by hand and where the woods are sourced. Does Terada give their inferior wood to the Electromatic factories? What constitutes superior wood for a Gretsch guitar? Is it the look of the grain, the sound quality or both?

On an unrelated note, after playing my Gretsch Renown drums this weekend, I was wondering what it would sound like if a hollowbody guitar were to have the silver sealer on the inside like the drums do.

I think you made yourself quite clear, Tavo. But once we know those details, do we still inevitably get left with personal perceptions of comparative sound qualities? And then we get on to the degree of difference that can be made to the acoustic properties generated by the tonewoods by the choice of pickups (everyone seems to agree a 5120 can be made to sound much better with aftermarket pickups in it). And then, how much of a factor is the amp? If it was a classical guitar or a violin, those factors wouldn't contribute as much, but we're talking electrics. Perhaps a "better Gretsch" could be created using woods that were never considered back in the day...koa? Or are there other woods now being sourced that would be better? Is the answer actually just to have a guitar built by a luthier to your specs? Then we get into the silly Zachary domain. You pay even more for those, AND go through a personal evaluation process by the luthier to determine whether you are worthy. So, what you pay for is, perhaps, what you deserve .

for me personally, I dont want to be told what hardware and electronics are gonna be in my gretsch, so I would like to really know if I am indeed getting premium wood for the pro line price or is the electromatic more or less the same exact thing for the electromatic price?
If the later, then I would go purchase an electro nashville, take out all the electronics, burn them in the fire and fill it up with my favorite goodies and then with the extra dollars send it to Curt for a fret dressing, new nut and a bit of soft V shaping on the back of the neck. If that can happen for under a grand, thats something right there.

I never thought I would be saying this but the only person earth who can really define what is a "Real Gretsch" has to be Fred Gretsch III. If it has his approval for the name on the headstock then it's a real Gretsch. I dont see why an eleoctromatic is any less of a Gretsch than a Pro series?

Being a vintage guy means I am not that well informed about the modern guitars but I recently played a chinese built pro jet that was absolutely fantastic. I then played another......that was spot on too. The pickups were not as good but in terms of feel and build they were great and superb value for money.

The 6120 CGP that I owned was a quality guitar with superb finishing and hardware but it played & felt no better than the pro jet I played recently although they were both very different guitars. The 6120 CGP certainly played better than the 55 and 56 6120's I owned but the vintage stuff is where my heart is because they are the originals and the Brooklyn template.

I once started a thread about modern gretsches not being real etc etc and to be honest it made me cringe when I last re read through it. End of the day if you love your Gretsch guitar and its made you happy then its a real one - wherever its made!

I would like to say that what really annoys me about the modern Gretsches is the slight lack of detail and poly finish. Its fine to reissue all the classic 50s and 60s guitars but they must get it 100% right. The custom shop stuff is wonderful, high end guitar building but they are still wrong in places if you compare them to the originals and the same with some of the pro series. I just dont like poly and I am gretsch geek so I need 100% authenticity

That is far more important to me than where it's made

My 3140 doesn't sound like a Gibson or Fender. Works for me.

My 3140 doesn't sound like a Gibson or Fender. Works for me.

...just checking in to see if Tavo has reached a conclusion yet...

One difference between the prolines and most electromatics is the neck construction. The electromatics have a scarf joint and some also have a laminated heel. My old G5129 and my Historic G3905 also had plywood neck blocks.

These are cost cutting compromises and their effect on the sound of the guitar may be subjective (Bob Taylor for one, swears that his scarf jointed necks are as good, and stronger than say, Gibson or Martin necks). But with the prolines, you are paying for that more expensive, long piece of wood for the neck.