The Gretsch Pages: Discussions: Gretsch Amps: MF Discounts 6163 Executive Amplifier

MF Discounts 6163 Executive Amplifier

« » Page 1 2 3

- Rated: 66 ↑
Jul 28, 2008 11:30 a.m. Walter Broes:

Sounds like the 3X10 has "brownface" tremolo - if you describe it as "univibey", the brownface Fenders had that, it's almost vibrato, there's a phasey quality to it. Lovely sound, but for stage I prefer the more common "blackface" optocoupler trem, it doesn't get drowned out on stage or in a mix like the more subtle kinds of trem.

But the brownface trem sure is pretty!

I'm not surprised the 3X10 has a lot of bass - most multiple 10" setups do, and I find the bass easier to dial in/out with tens than with twelves.

And I'm not too suprised you never really bonded with the Harvard - speaker is just too small in those things for anything but slide or harp IMO.

I've played a Super Reverb for fifteen years, so I love the BF/SF amps too, and my current infatuation with tweeds is fairly recent : the studio we recorded our last CD at had an incredible narrow panel Super amp that just refused to sound bad, no matter what guitar I plugged into it. Keep the volume and tone controls low and it's almost a blackface amp, turn things up for more breakup and compression.

I love how treble notes are just bigger and fatter on the tweeds, compared to the BF amps - but that was not the topic of this thread....

edit : oh, and I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting reverb, I'm the same! I'm anxiously awaiting delivery of an outboard rev/trem unit, check out the "admiral girth" on www.mergili.com ....! (a friend from Austin is coming over in two weeks, and bringing one that's being built for me right now - I'm really counting days!)
- Rated: 28 ↑
Jul 28, 2008 1:58 p.m. Wishinfora(nother)Falcon:

Man, I gotta play through one of these. I suppose I should wait til I have the scratch to take it home though.

I hear ya on the three 10s. I think that would be about perfect. The 4 10s on my Super can get pretty bassy. Lots more really than my 412 Marshall cab (at least with a 50w head pushing it). 3 10s just seem ideal for texture without too much bottom.

BTW Prot, I just love to read you try to describe tone. You have a real beauty with language that CAN actually make me visualize better than anything I get anywhere else. I know that tone is perceived and felt much better than described with words, unfortunately I'd be willing to bet there is not a Gretsch amp within 20 hours of me. Oh well, that's life in the country, as they say.
- Rated: 15 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 8:35 a.m. bobframe:

This just in from a Victoria Amp product planning session:

“Ok people, I've got an announcement to make. As you all know, we make some pretty fair amps and have a nice little following. We make about 15 models or so in lots of different styles, finishes, designs, power ratings, tube configurations and features. And we’ve not intentionally left out any possibilities- cause, well…why would we?

But as nice as we’ve made these amps and as complete as we’ve tried to make our lineup, the current line does not represent our very best efforts.

We have held this back until today.

You see, Gretsch (yes, this is really Fender with whom we compete at some level) has asked us to build a couple of amps that will actually be superior to the Victoria line. They will sound different than our Victoria Amps and THEY WILL SOUND BETTER.

We'll achieve this leap in performance through "new configurations" that never occurred to us before. Sounds odd, I admit, but this is what has happened.

Let’s be honest with ourselves….as hard as we have focused on building high quality amps and have tried to achieve that “boutique builder status”, Victoria Amps are really just Fender clones. Truth of the matter is, the amps we build and label under our competitor's name (Gretsch/FMIC) are really superior designs and better sounding products.

So, going forward our best products will be labeled Gretsch and our so-so "Fender clones" will carry the Victoria name. Yup, we have decided to sacrifice our brand by building a superior product under a private labeling relationship with our competitor.

OK, let’s take a few questions:

Q. Why doesn’t Fender doesn't build these special configuration amps themselves?

A. Great question.

Q. Wouldn't it make sense for Gretsch to keep this all in their family-especially since they designed these amps in the first place? And since Fender owns them and Fender builds just a few amps (HAHAHA), why not do it themselves? What in the heck do they need us for?

A. Another good one. Who’s next?

Q. Wouldn't it be cheaper for them to do it themselves than to pay us to do it? Can’t Fender buy raw materials cheaper than we can?

A. Nothing’s getting past you guys. Proud of you men.

Q. Aren’t they more capable than Victoria, since the configurations are of their design and all we really do anyways is clone Fender's products?

A. OK, boy’s, that’s all the time we have for questions-time for me to get back in the dunk tank.”
- Rated: 47 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 8:52 a.m. dmanlow:

Interesting. Where did you get this info from? I only ask because I didn't see it on the Victoria site.
- Rated: 12 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 11:19 a.m. KCMatt:

dmanlow: said: Interesting. Where did you get this info from? I only ask because I didn't see it on the Victoria site.

You might want to check the calibration on your sarcasm detector.
- Rated: 205 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 11:29 a.m. Proteus:

I get the sarcasm.

I don't get the point.
- Rated: 15 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 11:39 a.m. Otter:

I think he brings up a good point. Why does Victoria, a competitor of Fender (more likely seeing competition from Vintage Fender), contract to build amps FOR their competition? I guess money talks? Is it that the kind of guy (gal) who would buy a Victoria (or Gretsch) isn't likely to be looking at factory (non-Custom Shop) Fenders? Who makes the money in this deal? I know very little of economics (I study rocks), so maybe I shouldn't be looking at this from an economics standpoint.

I would like to know how many Gretsch amps are coming out of Victoria as opposed to Victoria amps. Do they build any amps under other brands?
- Rated: 52 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 11:52 a.m. bigalthethird:

Victoria builds amps under many brands, as far as I know. Am I right?
- Rated: 47 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 11:53 a.m. dmanlow:

KCMatt said: You might want to check the calibration on your sarcasm detector.

I think the calibration on the detector is alright but it appears I could do some work on the emiiter.
- Rated: 12 ↑
Aug 7, 2008 2:06 p.m. KCMatt:

I see.

I'll go sit in the corner and be quiet then......
- Rated: 37 ↑
Aug 8, 2008 10:59 p.m. Nobody:

Again, Fender does not own Gretsch. Fred Gretsch owns Gretsch. FMIC handles Gretsch operations for him.

Secondly, there is little that Fender now offers which gets into Victoria's hand-built market. I will gladly take a contract for guaranteed cash over worrying about whether I might lose a sale directly due to the existence of a new Fender 57 Deluxe...for a while, at least, and especially when "everybody and his brother" seems to want an accurate Fender clone. Cash or no cash? I'll take some extra cash, thanks.

My company contracts service offerings out to other firms that do SOME things that are similar to ours. But what I contract to them is different from, yet complimentary to their offerings. So they sell my offerings to their clients for me and, therefore, increase our market presence...and theirs.

Mutually beneficial business arrangements can result in greatly multiplied returns for both parties. For Victoria, it is at least another definite, assured revenue stream. Cash flow is king.
- Rated: 24 ↑
Aug 9, 2008 10:50 p.m. donwood:

I think that is a pretty good explanation Nobody. Don
- Rated: 46 ↑
Aug 10, 2008 3:24 a.m. Timthom62:

I think one of the things that confuses people is that the relationship isn't as clear as with the other Gretsch Products.

FMIC handles production, marketing and distribution of guitars and basses for Gretsch (reference gretschguitars.com). Kaman (apparently) handles production, marketing and distribution of Gretsch drums for Gretsch (reference gretschdrums.com). Victoria handles production of Gretsch amps for Gretsch, (except the 5222), but marketing and distribution are apparently handled by FMIC for Gretsch, a move that makes sense when you consider the relationship between guitars and amps. Why have a separate gretschamps.com?

Since the Gretsch amplifier warranty is actually a warranty by FMIC, just like the guitars, it may mean that FMIC wrote the specs for them or only that, as the distributor, they provide the warranty. It may be that Gretsch gave Victoria general specs and contracted with Victoria to design and build them and FMIC to market and distribute them. It may be that they're designed by elves in a hollow tree...

Whatever the case, the Gretsch amps I've tried have been some mighty fine amps and, if I ever win the lottery, I'm gonna get me a couple of them. However, as Nobody pointed out, as good as they are they're no threat to the Fender line of amps.

It sure would be nice to see them get moved to the "Gear" page at gretschguitars.com though...