can someone please tell me what is a mud switch and what does it do?
MUD SWITCH
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- Rated: 18 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 3:17 p.m. jimmy peters --oldest fart:
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- Rated: 55 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 3:41 p.m. otterbean:
It is a stick in the mud that you use to swat unruly children.
Its a tone switch on some Gretsch guitars that alters the tone. Makes it darker sounding. Other folks are more qualified to tell you exactly how it works.
In the central position, the switch is bypassed. Switched down the color of the sound is dulled a bit. Switch it up and the sound is heavily darkened.
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- Rated: 47 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 3:58 p.m. The Norm:
That's about it. Uses two capacitors and as described, two variants of loss of highs. It's a substitute for a tone control
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- Rated: 18 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 4:36 p.m. jimmy peters --oldest fart:
Rated: 47 ? Jul 15, 2008 3:41 p.m. otterbean: It is a stick in the mud that you use to swat unruly children.
this sounds like the best one.
what models was it used on?
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- Rated: 18 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 4:49 p.m. The Shetland:
I've wondered this too...is the mud switch the second toggle on FilterTron equipped guitars?
I've always wondered what that was for! Seems like Gretsch calls it a "Master Tone Selector"...I guess "Mud Switch" did'nt really appeal to the PR people...or me for that matter... :(
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- Rated: 9 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 5:06 p.m. mainsoda:
If you find a pick up configuration like the one on my 6119 (two switches and three volume knobs) then you found a mud switch. In my opinion it is aptly named. I keep mine in the center and just switch pick ups.
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- Rated: 205 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 5:57 p.m. Proteus:
Think of it as a preset tone control. The value of the capacitors on either leg of the 3-way switch determine how "dark" the guitar sounds in the two outer positions.
Gretsch seems to have used very "dark" values in the vintage era, resulting in the "mud" reputation. In recent years, the values have been revised and the the rolloffs are not so extreme.
For classic mudswitch Gretsch tones, think the solo in The Beatles' "Michelle," and similar tones used in leads by Stephen Stills with Crosby Stills & Nash – a smooth fat jazz tone.
I find it useful, though I don't have the knack to play the darkest position in a jazz idiom. The less-dark position (down on most guitars) pulls the bright Filtertrons back to something like humbucker brightness, and is quite useful clean or dirty. Both positions are a blast with distortion.
I've come to terms with the Tone Switch.
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- Rated: 54 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 6:04 p.m. Curt:
Sounds like a MUD SHOOTOUT is in order.
I'll do it if anyone is interested as I can do both old and new mud.
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- Rated: 41 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 6:04 p.m. J(esse James)D:
Some of the best "mud switch" duels were Stills and Young together.
Think 4-Way Street electrics, and the classic "Almost Cut My Hair"
White Falcons + Marshalls + mudswitch
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- Rated: 43 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 6:55 p.m. Ric12string:
Think the guitar solos on Wooden Ships.
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- Rated: 25 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 7:45 p.m. senojnad:
Personally, I have never liked "mud" switches, although -- truth be told -- I don't much use of tone controls on guitars either. I much prefer making those adjustments on the amp.
I believe Gretsch installs mud switches on guitars with FilterTron pickups, and tone (pot) controls on those with DynaSonics.
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- Rated: 54 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 9:16 p.m. Curt:
I finger picked this and it's quite repetitive but I wanted to keep the tone center the same. I also wanted some range so several notes are represented. I used the Deluxe amp with a reverb tank. The settings are, volume 3.5, treble 6.5, bass 4.5 and reverb at 2. I used the 58 Club first and the 2005 Falcon second in each example. It's continuous with the Club first then the Falcon with TV Classics. So.
C1 F1=neck no mud
C2 F2=neck mud up
C3 F3=neck mud down
C4 F4=bridge no mud
C5 F5=bridge mud up
C6 F5=bridge mud down
Disclaimer: I finished a large deck project yesterday and decided to hit my left hand with a hammer, HARD!
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- Rated: 18 ↑
Jul 15, 2008 11:02 p.m. jimmy peters --oldest fart:
thanks a million for the info guys. now i know why it is called a MUD switch. NO REFERENCE TO THE SORE HAND, HOPE IT HEALS SOON.
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- Rated: 54 ↑
Jul 16, 2008 8:37 a.m. Curt:
Anytime. Those examples aren't 100% what I was hearing but ceteris paribus applies here.
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- Rated: 0 ↑
Jul 16, 2008 1:10 p.m. micycle:
I have one of these switches on my green booger 6118-T; am more partial to just a tone knob myself, but I'm sure I'll be able to find a place for it in due time!
My only gripe is where it's placed on my guitar; more often than not I think I'm hitting the pickup toggle only to find out I hit the mud.
Haven't tried yet but I'd think it wouldn't be too hard to flip the two so the mud was more out of the way.
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- Rated: 54 ↑
Jul 17, 2008 6:26 a.m. Curt:
Haven't tried yet but I'd think it wouldn't be too hard to flip the two so the mud was more out of the way.
I know that JBGretschguy switched the two on his 6120'(s). -
- Rated: 20 ↑
Jul 28, 2008 8:46 a.m. gresco:
Just for your info: my 67 Rally (my avatar) had a mud switch with Hilotrons.
micycle: you could try rotating your p/u selector switch 90 degrees so that it moves fore and aft rather than up and down. That way it will point in the direction of the p/u you've selected and you of course couldn't mistakenly move the mud switch in that direction. Or you could do the same to the mud switch instead. I'm sure it take a short time to get used to it.
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- Rated: 15 ↑
Jul 28, 2008 7:36 p.m. AndyJ:
I actually find the "mud switch" serviceable on my Bamboo Annie . . . much to my surprise, as I've never messed with the tone knobs on any of my previous and/or existing guitars in the 18 years I've played.
Now, granted, I only use it in the up position, but I find that setting to take a bit of edge off my TVs (for a change of pace) when utilizing either both the neck and bridge p'up in unison (when doing a bit of fuller strumming) or with the bridge p'up alone. With that setting, I don't find my tone to be muddy at all . . .dark, yes.
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- Rated: 21 ↑
Jul 31, 2008 9:07 a.m. GentlBen:
I have a mud switch on my 6122sp but find it to be about as useless as the mutes (look good though!). Just don't have much use for tone controls. My rockabilly box is an Emperor Regant modified with 3 DeArmond 2K's straight wired to three volume knobs and no tone controls at all.
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- Rated: 19 ↑
Jul 31, 2008 10:27 a.m. DangerousMan:
I very rarely use mine either although for some slow, atmospheric soundscapes it can sound quite nice. Add a healthy dollop of reverb.
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- Rated: 5 ↑
Jul 31, 2008 2:57 p.m. Frankie:
Filter'Tron equipped guitars typically have the tone switch circuit. The cap values used stock are basically worthless, which is why it's called a mud switch. A quick cap switch will fix it. I used a .015 for the heavy mud and a .001 for the light mud values, I think. Now I can actually get usable tones out of the deal.
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- Rated: 54 ↑
Aug 4, 2008 4:18 p.m. Curt:
The mud switch discussion is interesting to me. There are some that totally discount the vintage mud tone and the modern. I look at it as another gear and really prefer the vintage tone because it adds texture and flavor. My view is that it wasn't intended to be used solo and is very much a unique tone to Gretsch.
Way before Al Gore invented the internet I bought my first Gretsch and found the mud switch to be a cool addition. There wasn't much information on it and I had to seek the little I found. So my advise is to experiment and don't take the cookie cutter approach.
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- Rated: 15 ↑
Aug 5, 2008 1:50 p.m. Matt:
Functionally, I prefer a tone switch type mechanism to knob hands down. I put a varitone switch in place of my tone knob in my electromatic, best of both worlds. Options like the tone knob, but ease of use like a tone switch. Looks pretty cool too.
If I had a guitar with a tone switch and a kill switch, I'd put the kill switch in place of the tone switch and a varitone where the kill switch used to be. I give 'em two thumps up.
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- Rated: 19 ↑
Aug 5, 2008 2:10 p.m. DangerousMan:
Hey mainsoda, would you not consider getting rid of mudswitch and adding a tone knob instead? (I only ask as I have the same config as yours on my firebird and have been thinking about it for a while.)
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- Rated: 18 ↑
Aug 16, 2008 3:46 p.m. jimmy peters --oldest fart:
fortunately on my duojet i dont have one,but it woult seam by changing the value of the caps you could find the tone you wanted. any way thanks a million for the info and to you curt for the sound example.
good luck jimmy peters
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