I am thinking about putting a Bigsby B7 on a Casino. My question is does the top have to strength to mount the screws. Other guitars are either solid wood or have a block running through them (semi-hollows). Anyone with experience here please chime in. I don't want to ruin what is already a nice guitar if a Bigsby is out of line or cause undue stress to the guitar.
Adding a Bigsby to a Casino
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- Rated: 6 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 7:50 a.m. TxLawman:
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- Rated: 19 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 10:36 a.m. Tennis_Nick:
Considering that Casino's have usually come with B7 (including George Harrison's Casino, and the recent offering from Epiphone), I think you'll be fine.
POST PICTURES!
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- Rated: 52 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 11:01 a.m. Pseudo Man:
I would drill the holes for the top screws in the face and put two little blocks of wood inside on the underside. So the screw goes through the bigsby, through the top, and into a block of wood against the inside of the top.
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- Rated: 13 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:04 p.m. PatRoss:
In my opinion this is where Gibson gets it wrong on hollow body guitars every time. They put B7's on their Es335 style guitars, which is fine. They have a block of wood running through the center and this combined with the tension bar on a B7 makes for very good sustain.
However, a hollow body guitar's top should resonate freely and this is why Gretsch equips their hollow body guitars with the B6.
I for one would recommend a B6 or licenced B60 for your Casino.
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- Rated: 23 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:11 p.m. Otter:
It's all about the neck angle. A B6 on a Casino results in a very shallow break angle over the stud mounted bridge. A B6 works on a Gretsch because the bridge sits up higher off the body and the neck is angled back more. This is the same reason the EE Jets have a B7 (stud mounted bridge) and the early Electromatic 512x's have a B7 (stud mounted bridge).
That said, some people (including a few on the GDP I believe) get away with B6's on Casinos and claim favorable results. It does seem like the trapeze type Bigsby would be the natural choice, since the Casino comes standard with a trapeze tailpiece. The difference is that the strings come across the TOP of a B6 and the strings come from UNDER the Casino trapeze, resulting in a small but appreciable change in the angle.
If I were to put a Bigsby on my Casino, however it will be a B7, mostly because of George Harrison. One thing I don't know is whether it's a common mod to add some wood under the Bigsby when adding a B7 to a full hollow body, like Pseudo Man recommends. I think some Casinos come from the factory with B7's (or Epi branded B7-alikes). It would be interesting to compare this to a standard Casino to see if they add some wood under the tailpiece.
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- Rated: 17 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:18 p.m. will:
i think you should be careful about a b6 on a hollow or 'not so hollow'-body.
for example: i had an epi295 a couple years ago (from the peerles factory) that had too little neck-angle for a b6. i had to make a deep cut in the bridge and the low E-string still would pop out on occasion.
later i sold that epi295 so i could buy the G6120DSV, but i couldn't resist a hollow-body with P90's ...
so when another 'came by', i had to buy it. and guess what: this one (from the unsung-factory) has a steeper neck-angle. so the b6 is the way to go on this example.
i hope this helps.
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- Rated: 13 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:20 p.m. PatRoss:
Thanks will, I hadn't thought of that angle. No pun intended. I guess you would need a floating bridge on there too. :-(
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- Rated: 23 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:23 p.m. Otter:
If you do put a B7 on your Casino, try to find the bridge with the nylon saddles, or buy graphtech saddles, as the strings will less likely bind when using the Bigsby.
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- Rated: 17 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:24 p.m. will:
not necessarily (sp?). i have a couple of DeArmonds with the 'Digsby' complete with rollerbar and lp-style tune-o-matic bridges. that works too, although with a bit more friction.
i dunno what bridge the casino has, but you can always change that later.
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- Rated: 23 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:33 p.m. Otter:
I agree that the regular Tune-o-matic bridges will work fine, but nylon or graph-type saddles will work a little better.
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- Rated: 60 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:35 p.m. dignan:
A B3 will fit on a Casino; a B6 would put the handle up near the neck pickup (which may be to your liking). The trouble with a B6 on a thinline is that the mounting plate is usually too long for the guitar.
It's not perfect, given the neck angle, but it can work if your bridge has deep saddle slots or you have an especially light picking hand.
Metal saddles are fine with a Bigsby; the trick is that they must be cut & filed perfectly - which they almost never are out-of-the-box.
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- Rated: 23 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 12:40 p.m. Otter:
Aha, that's the guitar I had in mind. Thanks, dig.
Good point about the B3 vs B6. I see I was mistaken. I've also heard of B3's on Les Pauls, but with similar consideration to saddle-cut depth.
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- Rated: 6 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 1:34 p.m. TxLawman:
I'm gonna have to get a mirror through an F-Hole or through the pickup route and see what the bracing looks like in there. There must be a reason they came with B7's in a special edition a couple of years ago and it makes me wonder if they had special bracing for that model or if it is the same as now.
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- Rated: 19 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 2:07 p.m. Tennis_Nick:
That "special edition" is now a regular production model, but not on the website just yet.
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- Rated: 6 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 2:34 p.m. TxLawman:
It must be new. I don't see it for sale on any of the normal music web sites. My wife has offered to get me the Elitist, which I might take her up on even without a Bigsby. Makes me wonder what she wants me to buy for the house that she hasn't asked for yet...
Any experience with the Elitist? You can never have too many guitars.
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- Rated: 60 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 5:19 p.m. dignan:
Otter said: I've also heard of B3's on Les Pauls, but with similar consideration to saddle-cut depth.
True - I had a B3 on my Pro Jet, which in regards to neck angle & bridge mounting may as well be a Les Paul. So long as the saddle slots were well-cut and deep, I never ran into any string-jumping problems. Again, it's less than ideal, but it is workable.TxLawman, I've heard nothing but good things about the higher-end Lennon & Elitist Casinos, which are (or at least were) made in the same Terada plant as new Gretsches. Specifically, they are reported to have lighter, more vintage-correct bracing than the Korean models.
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- Rated: 72 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 6:09 p.m. BigJimSlade:
Tx, I easily put a B-7 on my Riviera and it functions flawlessly. No worries, mate.
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- Rated: 14 ↑
Jun 24, 2009 10:50 p.m. Vern:
I had a Casino and had my tech install a Bigsby. He didn't add any bracing, just screwed it in w/no problems. The thing is, If I had it to do over again I wouldn't do it. It totally ruined the balance of the guitar IMHO. I loved how light it was before, the Bigsby changed that a lot.
Just something to consider.
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- Rated: 13 ↑
Jun 25, 2009 9:09 a.m. PatRoss:
The Epiphone Elitist were, that is WERE because it is my understanding that they have been discontinued, which is very sad. These were by far the best thing Gibson had done with Epiphone, very high quality guitars. Guess folks just balked at paying over $1,000 for a guitar with Epiphone on the headstock. I have passed on a very nice Elitist Casino because someone had installed a B70 on it and stripped one of the screw heads in the process, so it can not be removed. I have had the opportunity to play stock Elitist Casinos with a stock traipse tail piece and these sounded quite a bit brighter to my ear.
Big Jim, your Riviera, a really good nice guitar by the way, has a center block and is exactly the kind of guitar that the B7 was designed for. The Casino does not have center block.
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- Rated: 19 ↑
Jun 25, 2009 7:17 p.m. Tennis_Nick:
The elitist Casino's aren't discontinued... they're just in a different spot on the website.
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- Rated: 6 ↑
Jun 25, 2009 7:30 p.m. TxLawman:
the 63 Elitist 335 Dot was discontinued. A fine guitar.
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- Rated: 88 ↑
Jun 30, 2009 5:30 p.m. BillyZoom:
A vintage Duo Jet is MORE hollow than a Casino, and so is a 6120.
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- Rated: 13 ↑
Jul 1, 2009 9:37 a.m. PatRoss:
I can see where a 6120 or any other jazz box size hollowbody guitar is MORE hollow than a Casino because they are thicker than a Casino.
However, a Duo Jet is smaller than a Casino and chambered not hollow so I don't understand how it is possible for a Duo Jet to be MORE hollow than a Casino. Unless of course you are thinking that a Casino is a Semi-Hollowbody like a Gibson ES-335. The Casino does not have a center block, it is hollow on the inside except for the bridge support posts and/or a true hollowbody.
:-(
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- Rated: 60 ↑
Jul 1, 2009 5:33 p.m. dignan:
I think Billy may have been using hyperbole to compare a vintage Duo Jet, which was very heavily chambered, with the relatively-bulky-for-a-hollowbody bracing of a modern Korean Casino.
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- Rated: 60 ↑
Jul 1, 2009 5:34 p.m. dignan:
Or I could just be posting out of my ass, I can't even tell anymore.
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