Yes there IS a God! After much pain & suffering, I got a beat up 65 to work on. Just making my friend The StudioBigShotBeatleFreak come to MY place to see it [he HASN'T got one.....] was worth all the grief finding it! Body is great, neck has all the trouble. It has a replaced fingerboard in ebony with block markers - the guy did a good job, but it just aint "right". I have some Braz-R-wood coming to make a new board, I'll do a neck reset while I'm at it. Anybody done a f-board for any model Gretsch & knows a good way to do the half-moon inlays? It also has a real but GOLD bar bridge. Opinions wanted - find a real or replacement chrome bar or put on a tune-a-matic? Neck angle - shallow angle gives best sustain, higher angle gives more tone. Most of the old Tenny's I see pics of seem to have a pretty shallow angle. Mine is SOOOOOOO shallow that I can't get the action down without the strings floating in air above the bridge. Opinions? Otherwise, it's about what I expected & I'll have a good time doing the restoration. Last one - any opinions on fret size? I've done thousands of repair jobs over the years, but somehow this one is special -because it's MINE! Gotta find the right combo of tradition vs function. Thanks in advance.
Just got a Tennessean
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- Rated: 3 ↑
May 7, 2008 8:31 p.m. AndrewMarr:
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Jun 7, 2008 9:32 p.m. AndrewMarr:
Hey Andy, not gettin' much response to this one eh? Oh well, lemme tell ya; I got the neck off, then took off the ebony fingerboard. Looks like real Gibson issue - seriously nice pearl block markers. Use that for some other project. Very strange neck joint. Does NOT look like a re-hash though. The body shape, looking at it from the rear, takes a dive from the upper bout to the cutaway - just a slight slope, but enough to prevent the neck from setting in at a right angle to the body. Everything looks like it was put together to compensate - BIG shim in the pocket, pickup holes trimmed off the center-line, Bigsby set a little on an angle. I re-set the neck straight. Used a 2 degree slope to give some better clearance over the bridge in future. It appears that the reason all this fingerboard biz happened, was a broken truss rod. The new one works just fine, but the person who put on the ebony board must have destroyed the original one getting it off. Now another question pitched to anybody who might know - did 65's use Braz R-Wood exclusively? Was Gretsch useing any Indian yet at this time? I paid a pile for some supposed Braz on ebay. Got it to the jointer to take the wax off - no perfume - smelled like hmmmmmmmm, jungle........the guy I bought it from claimed to know nothing, maybe so. Colour was wrong also once the wax was gone. I took it to the best exotic-wood company in our area, they said it might be cocobolo, might be some species close to dalbergia nigra, but it wasn't what I hoped it was. Too bad. I have some Indian that looks close, going to use that I guess. What about the half-moon inlays? I think I have to make a template & cut them with a router. Were/are they cut before or after the board is curved? Anybody done this or have a better way of making them? I'll take some pics next time I'm at my shop.
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Jun 7, 2008 9:37 p.m. wenzel:
Can you post a picture?
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Jun 7, 2008 11:09 p.m. Lee Erickson (aka rvwinkle):
I own a Tennessean that I bought new in 1966. I'm sympathetic to your rebuild, these are special instruments that deserve some respect.
For the fretboard, I'm pretty sure it's rosewood. At that time, probably Brazilian. I'd probably go with whatever piece has a nice looking grain structure, probably Indian these days.
I took out a dial caliper and measured the frets. They generally measure 0.030" high and 0.080" wide at the fretboard level. The zero fret is 0.060" high and 0.100" wide at the base.
When your using a Bigsby, I think a bar bridge is the way to go. Whatever, the bridge should move with the strings when using the Bigsby.
In your '65 The adjuster screws should easily pull out of the bridge base. The heads should be rounded so they can rock in the holes in the bridge base. The vintage bridges have the adjuster screws 1.75" apart.
Modern Gretsches have the pins fixed in the bridge base at about 1.88" apart. The bottom of the bar bridge is rounded, so it still rocks, but a different deal than the vintage Gretsches.
It's likely that the bridge on your guitar is a Country Gent bar. Just make sure it can move with the Bigsby.
The half moon fret markers on mine match the fret board exactly. I'm thinking that they were installed and sanded to match.
If you need further measurements or pictures, let me know.
Lee
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- Rated: 3 ↑
Jun 8, 2008 1:31 p.m. AndrewMarr:
Lee, thanks for your info. I have to decide if I should do the half moons with a drill press & various sized bits offset to only get a partial cut, or make a template & use a router. Being a one-off makes that kinda overkill, but maybe buying all the bits is worse, especially since they have to be larger than the holes to look right. Maybe a set of Forstner bits would be a worthwhile investment here? My Streamliner & Country Gent have somewhat irregular moons, a few are the same size rather than all graduated up the board, & on the Streamer they're not all set in from the edge to the same degree. Suggests a guy on a drill press? Wenzel, I'll take some pics next time I get out to my shop. A.
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Jun 8, 2008 5:45 p.m. Lee Erickson (aka rvwinkle):
Here's the measurements on the markers from my Tennessean:
Between Frets Width Length Diameter Dia Frac
0-1;2-3 0.202" 0.713" 0.831" 13/164-5;6-7 0.202 0.633 0.730 3/4
8-9;11-12 0.202 0.489 0.498 1/2
14-15;16-17 0.161 0.389 0.398 3/8
Sorry about the funny table. If you copy and paste it in something with a constant space font, like Notepad, it should line up and make some sense.
My sense is that using something like a Forstner bit would tend to pull some nasty chips out of the edge of the hole. Not to mention all the trouble you would have clamping the neck down so that you could get an accurate location.
The one reference I have on inlays suggests to do it like this:
1) Glue the inlay temporarily onto the fret board.
2) Scribe a line around the inlay with an Xacto knife.
3) Remove the inlay.
4) Deepen the scribe line, this helps avoid chipping.
5) Use a Moto Tool with a router base for cutting.
Disclaimer! I have NOT actually done this myself.
Lee
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Jun 12, 2008 10:20 a.m. riz:
I just saw a 64/65 nashville with indian. I've never routed for half moons but it wouldn't be hard to set up a jig that used router guides to follow holes...with the proper ratios of guides/cutters/holes you could use much larger holes than the diameter of the inlays and just use one 1/4" end mill. I've only done a couple of these, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were only four different radii of pearl used for all the inlays. Maybe they're common size cutters or close enough. Havn't checked. For cutting pearl to size I just dig around in my socket drawer till I find one with the same o.d. and superglue pearl to it. The chrome plating is hard and resists filing. Dip it in acetone when done, and there ya go. I've lucked out with that one so far. You want to do a nice job routing cleanly. Rosewood is not as forgiving as ebony when you fill it, but I'm sure you know that. Why not use Brazilian, it's much nicer, as long as you get a nice cut. As for fret wire, regular acoustic wire (specs escape me at the moment, we get ours from LMI...) matches vintage spec well, but I've been intrigued by the medium high, medium wide wire lately. Have fun!
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Jun 24, 2008 2:33 p.m. chetarmpinkie:
ok im in suspense and drooling here .can some one please post some pics this sounds like an awesome project ....oh how do you post pics?
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Jun 25, 2008 9:06 p.m. AndrewMarr:
Lee & Riz, really good ideas. Using sockets is perfect, I never thought of that in all the years I've been at this. Lee Valley Tools up here sells a set of Forstners that has a razor edge with center brad that they claim won't chip because it scores such a clean line before the chippers clean out the center. They also say it will allow you to ride out over an edge where the center brad isn't making contact & the edge will still cut clean without wandering. Never had any so I wonder about that. A template is probably the way. Oddly Lee's figures suggest it might be possible with only four or five bits? Naw, I'm just being lazy about making the template.....I need a holiday, or some days with my guitars......I've been several weeks at my other incarnation, home-reno-man, so I've done no guitar work, made no progress, & no pics to post yet. Granny's tired....
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Jun 27, 2008 3:58 p.m. AndrewMarr:
Ok Lads, how do I add some pics? I posted a couple one other time but don't seem to be having any luck today. Can I do several at once? Is it best to copy them & drop them in, or can it only be done with the ikon in this box?
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Jun 27, 2008 4:01 p.m. Bear:
You have to put them on a picture sharing site like PhotoBucket and then enter the URL. Bax has the direct download system turned off in order for the site to work as well as it is. It's really easy to do even for me.
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Jun 27, 2008 4:26 p.m. AndrewMarr:
And where would this be found B? Is there a direct link? Wait...Just found it. Join yet another dubious site with its nose in my business? Hmmmm. How about, members from THIS site ONLY who're interested can email me & I'll happily send them the pics? Sure would be easier to just have them here, but I guess space & other constraints prevail?
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Jun 27, 2008 4:35 p.m. Rocketman:
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Jun 27, 2008 4:53 p.m. AndrewMarr:
Hi R-Man, is imageshack diffrent from p-bucket? It seems that every one of these "share-your-life-with-the-world" sites carries the usual infection of spam, phishing, & hackers. How do people here find these sites & their security?
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Jun 27, 2008 5:02 p.m. otterbean:
I'd go with Forstner bits to cut the half moons. I would use a sacrificial strip next to the neck as I cut em' to make sure I didn't get any tear out. Drill press should make quick work of them.
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- Rated: 36 ↑
Jun 27, 2008 5:28 p.m. Rocketman:
Well use your own server then.
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Jun 28, 2008 10:30 a.m. AndrewMarr:
R, how do you mean? Set up a web-page with my server? Makes sense. Actually, I wonder if I could use a friend's who is already functioning. He might even like the extra traffic his stuff would see. Would there be aproblem linking from here? I've never done any of this stuff.
