The Gretsch Pages: Discussions: The Bass-ment: More Outrageous Pricing From Fender

More Outrageous Pricing From Fender

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- Rated: 24 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:18 a.m. Gretschadelphia:

Was thumbing through the new American Musical Supply flyer I recieved in the mail recently and was a little stupified when I saw that the out the door price for a MIM Road Worn Series 60's Jazz Bass Reissue was $1,249.00. I just recently ordered for my son a new Music Man Sterling Bass through Joel at Shanghai (yes, he's great on other brands besides Gretsch). For basically the same cost of the aforementioned MIM Fender he's getting a bass specifically built for him with top shelf components,spec's, and playability ec's that probably surpass even a Fender US Deluxe J Bass and also built in the good old USA (I have nothin' against MIM, MIJ, MIK, etc by the way). What is Fender thinking?
- Rated: 37 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:37 a.m. DangerousMan:

I've been wondering this myself - I still can't get my head around the 30% increase. Someone on here said that he heard it was due to an increase in the price of materials - but 30%? It's still a bizarre move in my book.
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Mar 20, 2009 10:17 a.m. dubkitty:

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Mar 20, 2009 1:23 p.m. Joel:

I think the Gretsch price increase was one of the dumbest moves I've seen. Maybe they had to. All I can say is if the prices would've at least stayed at the 2008 prices we would've have moved a whole lot more guitars. The problem with the 2009 economy is people feel even an increase as small as $80 now. So if you're a company you've now priced your product even further above what the used market is going for. So, you've just lost a sale. Keep in mind that used guitars don't count as income to any dealer, Fred Gretsch, Fender, Joe Carducci, or whoever's involved in the chain. In order for the company to move forward new models must be sold each year. If not then I'm sure the product line will be thinned, prices will be raised even further, etc, etc. I think before we got to that point it would be best if there was some kind of price break...
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Mar 20, 2009 1:37 p.m. CPR:

I hear ya Joel. I would have probably, no sh*t bought two fenders this year but for the price increase. In fact I had already planned on foregoing finishing my sleeves (tattoos) this year in favor of getting a Strat and a Jazzmaster. But with the price increase, I feel a bit like they are trying to hoodwink me. So no buyin' now. Not a smart move on their part in my opinion.
- Rated: 51 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 5:55 p.m. dubkitty:

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Mar 20, 2009 6:10 p.m. dubkitty:

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Mar 20, 2009 6:11 p.m. dubkitty:

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- Rated: 37 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 6:14 p.m. marctrain57:

I sure don't know anything about economics but I think this huge price increase was planned back when gas prices were soaring and a huge bump would have seen less shocking. With the economy dropping through the floor and some economist worrying about deflation a 30 % jump makes no sense. Corporations aren't too nimble and once the plans for the price increase were in motion no one had the will to change it.

We never know how sales are doing but I am sure that I think twice before I buy anything that is a luxury, and for a lousy guitar player like me a new guitar certainly is.

I can only imagine how some of these dealers with tons of inventory are doing.
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Mar 20, 2009 6:20 p.m. dubkitty:

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- Rated: 37 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 6:37 p.m. gretschiam:

Thanks to the guys on this site and the early tip, I grabbed a Highway One Tele right before the price increase. Nicest Tele I've ever played, by the way.

To echo Chonny, kudos to Joel for speaking out. While I don't know the real motives and considerations behind these decisions, I know it's not going to sell guitars.
- Rated: 103 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 7:10 p.m. bonedaddy:

Yeah, Guitar Showcase has a very large Fender inventory. I was in there a week or so ago and there were a lot of people in there, but there weren't a lot of people buying.

Even more interesting is that the foot traffic across the way in the building with the used gear was more than I've ever seen in there.
- Rated: 312 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 8:04 p.m. Proteus:

Joel, you don't make money on used guitars? First time I've ever heard THAT from a dealer! My local guy has been a stocking dealer for a number of prestige brands, but does best by far with really nice used stuff - which he seeks out, tweaks, treats with love and respect, and prices fairly. It's what makes going there a treat, and it's his bread-and-butter.

I don't think for a minute that FMIC can't change direction between last summer and now. I know they change direction in weeks, in fact. The price increase, whatever the reasons, was taken with full knowledge of the state of the economy.

We don't know FMIC's internal business, and we have no right to it – but I'd say dub's clear-eyed macro-economic analysis is worth some respect.

Those folks in Scottsdale aren't stupid.
- Rated: 89 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 8:23 p.m. Ric12string:

I dunno, but, what if we could look inside the walls in Scottsdale and learned that sales had actually increased despite the price increases? What might we say then?
- Rated: 63 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:20 p.m. Joel:

Proteus: said: Joel, you don't make money on used guitars? First time I've ever heard THAT from a dealer!

The problem is in bad economies people want as much as they can from that item. Especially when they don't have the funds to replace that item once it's gone. This isn't a normal economic climate we're living in if you haven't noticed. We have been in business for 10 years and there isn't a year to really compare this year to. Right now, we have customers that get almost violent when we make them an offer. Almost to the point of tears. These are people facing getting their utilities cut off. Facing losing their automobile. We have no major employer in our town anymore, hence no money. I guess you may know more about my town than I do. My apologies for my stupidity...
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Mar 20, 2009 9:23 p.m. Whofan:

How about a government bailout for Fender? That would bring prices down...
- Rated: 63 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:28 p.m. Joel:

Proteus: said: Those folks in Scottsdale aren't stupid.

I never said they where, I said the price raise was a bad idea. I've known the folks in Scottsdale for almost a decade and always give credit when credit is due. I am however an honest man and can't lie. This is a board full of opinions and mine is just one of many. I am a dealer and I do realize the gravity of someone in my position making such a statement. The thing is that I am in charge of moving guitars and I prefer being given tools that help me do my job. Otherwise my hands are tied....
- Rated: 11 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:32 p.m. GoDogGo:

Will the quality of Fenders improve (meaning: consistancy in fit and finish, woods, tone, etc.) Will there be any added benefit to us consumers with this increased price? Will the increase in costs eventually lead to higher wages for workers?

I personally am done with any new Fender guitars. There are thousands of used ones floating around - if they were good enough to buy in 1995, I'll go find one from 1995 and pay 1/3 of the cost... if it has a few dings and dents, I will then call it: Road Worn!

Boycott Fender! Time for a grassroots revolt!
- Rated: 11 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:33 p.m. jc28:

Joel said: We have been in business for 10 years and there isn't a year

I have owned a discount store for 10 years and you are right, I have never heard " is that the best you can do" more than in the last few months, alot of the times they are asking about a $5 tee shirt or today it was a .99 cent bank. I don't mind people asking but it scares me that they have to.

Whofan said: How about a government bailout for Fender? That would bring prices down...

So far it seems the only thing that the bailouts are good for is making head lines.
- Rated: 312 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:34 p.m. Proteus:

And I didn't mean to imply you were stupid, Joel, by any means. I only know your town from what you've said of it, and certainly can't judge it or your situation in its business environment.

I just remember from my years in retail that when new stuff was too expensive, used gear got more interesting to people, and we did more of our business there.

That's all I meant, sorry if it came across any other way.

Bottom line: FMIC, like all of us, can be assumed to be trying to do its best in a difficult time. None of us really knows the realities and necessities of the other's situation, and I have to think all of us are making the choices we believe we have to make.

Part of the consequence of the current economic environment, and a nasty feedback loop into it, is that everyone is essentially boycotting everyone else.

That doesn't help anyone.
- Rated: 11 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 9:39 p.m. GoDogGo:

Actually, I feel that a good old boycott will help. I'll haunt my local pawn store, or wait until my Fender dealer has one pop up used. No need to buy a new guitar. This is evident by all the strange variations of the Stratocaster that keeps coming out! Fender keeps adding a new variation - my guess is to get me to have 13 different Stratocasters. I repeat: There are thousands of Fenders out there... and now "Road Worn" is in fashion thanks to Fender's marketing department. http://www.getroadworn.com/

The consumer is king... perhaps you have read about the consumer backlash against Tropicana? http://blogs.ft.com/gapperblog/2009/02/pulp-friction-at-tropicana/

Seems people got very upset when they changed their label... no change in product quality (still nutritious orange juice), or quantity (same amount of juice in the jug). But people spoke up and they changed the label back. Now if a bunch of OJ drinkers can get upset and motivated about a label change and let the company know... shouldn't a bunch of punk rockin' greasy guitar players like us speak up, too?!

According to the Fender.com website, you may reach the FMIC Consumer Relations Department by telephone, fax or e-mail at:

Telephone: (480) 596-7195 Fax: (480) 367-5262 E-mail: consumerrelations@fender.com<img
- Rated: 24 ↑
Mar 20, 2009 10:36 p.m. Gretschadelphia:

The other shoe that seems to be dropping now is that Fender is further "Gibsonizing" things by trying to force dealers into buying larger numbers of guitars and requiring that they stock other FMIC products. The local independent shop that I've bought my last two guitars from are considering dropping Fender altogether (and they are a big Fender dealer). They dropped Gibson a couple of years ago and picked up PRS. They currently also have G&L and find them much easier to deal with and the USA G&L's are around the same price as the US Fenders and in some cases actually cheaper. Also, both G&L and PRS have affordable import lines that are very high quality. Ernie Ball/Music Man is also coming out with import versions of their more popular models that are supposed to be aggressively priced and as good as the G&L Tributes and PRS SE's.
- Rated: 38 ↑
Mar 21, 2009 7:36 a.m. CnW:

My nearest shop did drop Fender in the last few months. He still has Fender and Gretsch stuff, but it's used. New guitars on the wall are Ibanez. The decision could not have been made lightly.
- Rated: 2 ↑
Mar 21, 2009 10:06 a.m. gravydb:

I bought a brand new Fender American Deluxe Strat about a month before the price hike, and I never knew the price increase was coming! Boy do I feel lucky! But anyway here's my opinion... personally I never felt that Fender's products were expensive. Their prices have always been quite fair, price vs "value" (again, this is just my opinion). You can easily spend MUCH more money on MANY other brands.

My theory is that Fender's profit has typically been volume driven. And with the state of the economy, and the understandable decrease in units sold, they are now forced to increase their prices. Fender is quite confident that people will continue to buy, just not as many as usual.

All that being said, I am certainly not happy with the price increase. A Hot Rod Deluxe is now $850?!? A 2x12 Deville is $1000?!?! I know, it sounds steep in comparison to the old prices, but I still think that overall you are getting your money's worth.
- Rated: 23 ↑
Mar 21, 2009 10:40 a.m. Joe Hi-LoTron:

I remember playing a 1st generation Japanese Gretsch RI and NEW Hot Rod Deluxe @ Fullers in Houston.

Was was back around late 2000, early '01. Should have jumped on it, but who knew at the time.

The RI was on consignment for $400 and the HRD could be had for $500 ($350 if I bought them both that day)!